Can the Living Rune feature increase your ability scores over 20?












2












$begingroup$


The Rune Scribe prestige class (from Unearthed Arcana: Prestige Classes and Rune Magic) has the 4th level Living Rune feature:




At the end of a long rest, you can choose to increase one ability score of your choice by 2 or increase two ability scores of your choice by 1. At the end of each subsequent long rest, you can alter this choice, reducing the scores you previously increased and improving different scores. (If you chose to increase two abilities, you can opt to alter only one of those choices.)




This feature is meant to be similar to the Ability Score Improvement feature that other regular classes have, but those features also specifically say:




As normal, you can't increase an ability score above 20 using this feature.




However, this ability from the Rune Scribe doesn't specifically say that you can't break the ability score limit of 20 - and I don't know how the prestige classes of previous editions behaved, hence my reason for the question.



Can the Living Rune feature increase your ability scores over 20?










share|improve this question











$endgroup$

















    2












    $begingroup$


    The Rune Scribe prestige class (from Unearthed Arcana: Prestige Classes and Rune Magic) has the 4th level Living Rune feature:




    At the end of a long rest, you can choose to increase one ability score of your choice by 2 or increase two ability scores of your choice by 1. At the end of each subsequent long rest, you can alter this choice, reducing the scores you previously increased and improving different scores. (If you chose to increase two abilities, you can opt to alter only one of those choices.)




    This feature is meant to be similar to the Ability Score Improvement feature that other regular classes have, but those features also specifically say:




    As normal, you can't increase an ability score above 20 using this feature.




    However, this ability from the Rune Scribe doesn't specifically say that you can't break the ability score limit of 20 - and I don't know how the prestige classes of previous editions behaved, hence my reason for the question.



    Can the Living Rune feature increase your ability scores over 20?










    share|improve this question











    $endgroup$















      2












      2








      2





      $begingroup$


      The Rune Scribe prestige class (from Unearthed Arcana: Prestige Classes and Rune Magic) has the 4th level Living Rune feature:




      At the end of a long rest, you can choose to increase one ability score of your choice by 2 or increase two ability scores of your choice by 1. At the end of each subsequent long rest, you can alter this choice, reducing the scores you previously increased and improving different scores. (If you chose to increase two abilities, you can opt to alter only one of those choices.)




      This feature is meant to be similar to the Ability Score Improvement feature that other regular classes have, but those features also specifically say:




      As normal, you can't increase an ability score above 20 using this feature.




      However, this ability from the Rune Scribe doesn't specifically say that you can't break the ability score limit of 20 - and I don't know how the prestige classes of previous editions behaved, hence my reason for the question.



      Can the Living Rune feature increase your ability scores over 20?










      share|improve this question











      $endgroup$




      The Rune Scribe prestige class (from Unearthed Arcana: Prestige Classes and Rune Magic) has the 4th level Living Rune feature:




      At the end of a long rest, you can choose to increase one ability score of your choice by 2 or increase two ability scores of your choice by 1. At the end of each subsequent long rest, you can alter this choice, reducing the scores you previously increased and improving different scores. (If you chose to increase two abilities, you can opt to alter only one of those choices.)




      This feature is meant to be similar to the Ability Score Improvement feature that other regular classes have, but those features also specifically say:




      As normal, you can't increase an ability score above 20 using this feature.




      However, this ability from the Rune Scribe doesn't specifically say that you can't break the ability score limit of 20 - and I don't know how the prestige classes of previous editions behaved, hence my reason for the question.



      Can the Living Rune feature increase your ability scores over 20?







      dnd-5e prestige-class ability-scores unearthed-arcana






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      edited 4 hours ago









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          $begingroup$

          No, it can't increase your ability scores over 20.



          The normal ability score limit of 20 is reiterated in a few different places in the 5e rules. First, in Chapter 1 of the PHB/basic rules, under the "Class Features and Hit Dice" subheading below "Beyond 1st Level":




          When your character gains a level, his or her class often grants additional features, as detailed in the class description. Some of these features allow you to increase your ability scores, either increasing two scores by 1 each or increasing one score by 2. You can’t increase an ability score above 20. In addition, every character's proficiency bonus increases at certain levels.




          It reiterates that the normal limit for adventurers is 20 in Chapter 7, under the "Ability Scores and Modifiers" heading:




          Each of a creature's abilities has a score, a number that defines the magnitude of that ability. An ability score is not just a measure of innate capabilities, but also encompasses a creature's training and competence in activities related to that ability.



          A score of 10 or 11 is the normal human average, but adventurers and many monsters are a cut above average in most abilities. A score of 18 is the highest that a person usually reaches. Adventurers can have scores as high as 20, and monsters and divine beings can have scores as high as 30.




          As shown by the above quotes, the text in the Ability Score Improvement feature that mentions the limit is actually redundant; even if it weren't in that feature's description, the ASI feature would still not let adventurers exceed the ability score maximum of 20.



          Although Prestige Classes as described in that Unearthed Arcana document are not exactly normal classes, the UA describes them as following the multiclassing rules, with additional prerequisites. Nothing in the UA says their Living Rune feature lets them supersede the normal ability score maximum - so they must still obey that limit.






          share|improve this answer









          $endgroup$













          • $begingroup$
            Oh XD I didn't know an answer came up im on mobile and was typing haha. Well good answer though you saw a point o didn't <3 keep up good work !!
            $endgroup$
            – Deceptecium
            4 hours ago



















          2












          $begingroup$

          It wouldn't be unheard of for a class feature to increase a stat above 20.



          Primal Champion page 49. PHB Barbarian level 20 feature.

          Your strength and Constitution scores increase by 4. Your maximum for those scores is now 24.



          However this is a level 20 feature and it specifically states that it increases the maximum of the score.



          Page 173 of the PHB, under the Ability Scores and Modifiers section says: "A score of 18 is the highest a person usually reaches. Adventurers can have scores as high as 20, and monsters and divine beings can have scores as high as 30.



          Considering specific beats general, since the Rune Scribe UA prestige class doesn't specifically say that it increases the ability score max, then it doesn't.






          share|improve this answer










          New contributor




          Deceptecium is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.






          $endgroup$













          • $begingroup$
            Your last line is in error: Specific beats general means that Rune Scribe doesn't need to explicitly state anything to create an exception to a general rule. That's how scoping works: since Rune Scribe is contained within the rules for creating player characters, any/all of its rules supercede the higher scope rules for creating characters whenever there is conflict.
            $endgroup$
            – the dark wanderer
            20 mins ago











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          $begingroup$

          No, it can't increase your ability scores over 20.



          The normal ability score limit of 20 is reiterated in a few different places in the 5e rules. First, in Chapter 1 of the PHB/basic rules, under the "Class Features and Hit Dice" subheading below "Beyond 1st Level":




          When your character gains a level, his or her class often grants additional features, as detailed in the class description. Some of these features allow you to increase your ability scores, either increasing two scores by 1 each or increasing one score by 2. You can’t increase an ability score above 20. In addition, every character's proficiency bonus increases at certain levels.




          It reiterates that the normal limit for adventurers is 20 in Chapter 7, under the "Ability Scores and Modifiers" heading:




          Each of a creature's abilities has a score, a number that defines the magnitude of that ability. An ability score is not just a measure of innate capabilities, but also encompasses a creature's training and competence in activities related to that ability.



          A score of 10 or 11 is the normal human average, but adventurers and many monsters are a cut above average in most abilities. A score of 18 is the highest that a person usually reaches. Adventurers can have scores as high as 20, and monsters and divine beings can have scores as high as 30.




          As shown by the above quotes, the text in the Ability Score Improvement feature that mentions the limit is actually redundant; even if it weren't in that feature's description, the ASI feature would still not let adventurers exceed the ability score maximum of 20.



          Although Prestige Classes as described in that Unearthed Arcana document are not exactly normal classes, the UA describes them as following the multiclassing rules, with additional prerequisites. Nothing in the UA says their Living Rune feature lets them supersede the normal ability score maximum - so they must still obey that limit.






          share|improve this answer









          $endgroup$













          • $begingroup$
            Oh XD I didn't know an answer came up im on mobile and was typing haha. Well good answer though you saw a point o didn't <3 keep up good work !!
            $endgroup$
            – Deceptecium
            4 hours ago
















          3












          $begingroup$

          No, it can't increase your ability scores over 20.



          The normal ability score limit of 20 is reiterated in a few different places in the 5e rules. First, in Chapter 1 of the PHB/basic rules, under the "Class Features and Hit Dice" subheading below "Beyond 1st Level":




          When your character gains a level, his or her class often grants additional features, as detailed in the class description. Some of these features allow you to increase your ability scores, either increasing two scores by 1 each or increasing one score by 2. You can’t increase an ability score above 20. In addition, every character's proficiency bonus increases at certain levels.




          It reiterates that the normal limit for adventurers is 20 in Chapter 7, under the "Ability Scores and Modifiers" heading:




          Each of a creature's abilities has a score, a number that defines the magnitude of that ability. An ability score is not just a measure of innate capabilities, but also encompasses a creature's training and competence in activities related to that ability.



          A score of 10 or 11 is the normal human average, but adventurers and many monsters are a cut above average in most abilities. A score of 18 is the highest that a person usually reaches. Adventurers can have scores as high as 20, and monsters and divine beings can have scores as high as 30.




          As shown by the above quotes, the text in the Ability Score Improvement feature that mentions the limit is actually redundant; even if it weren't in that feature's description, the ASI feature would still not let adventurers exceed the ability score maximum of 20.



          Although Prestige Classes as described in that Unearthed Arcana document are not exactly normal classes, the UA describes them as following the multiclassing rules, with additional prerequisites. Nothing in the UA says their Living Rune feature lets them supersede the normal ability score maximum - so they must still obey that limit.






          share|improve this answer









          $endgroup$













          • $begingroup$
            Oh XD I didn't know an answer came up im on mobile and was typing haha. Well good answer though you saw a point o didn't <3 keep up good work !!
            $endgroup$
            – Deceptecium
            4 hours ago














          3












          3








          3





          $begingroup$

          No, it can't increase your ability scores over 20.



          The normal ability score limit of 20 is reiterated in a few different places in the 5e rules. First, in Chapter 1 of the PHB/basic rules, under the "Class Features and Hit Dice" subheading below "Beyond 1st Level":




          When your character gains a level, his or her class often grants additional features, as detailed in the class description. Some of these features allow you to increase your ability scores, either increasing two scores by 1 each or increasing one score by 2. You can’t increase an ability score above 20. In addition, every character's proficiency bonus increases at certain levels.




          It reiterates that the normal limit for adventurers is 20 in Chapter 7, under the "Ability Scores and Modifiers" heading:




          Each of a creature's abilities has a score, a number that defines the magnitude of that ability. An ability score is not just a measure of innate capabilities, but also encompasses a creature's training and competence in activities related to that ability.



          A score of 10 or 11 is the normal human average, but adventurers and many monsters are a cut above average in most abilities. A score of 18 is the highest that a person usually reaches. Adventurers can have scores as high as 20, and monsters and divine beings can have scores as high as 30.




          As shown by the above quotes, the text in the Ability Score Improvement feature that mentions the limit is actually redundant; even if it weren't in that feature's description, the ASI feature would still not let adventurers exceed the ability score maximum of 20.



          Although Prestige Classes as described in that Unearthed Arcana document are not exactly normal classes, the UA describes them as following the multiclassing rules, with additional prerequisites. Nothing in the UA says their Living Rune feature lets them supersede the normal ability score maximum - so they must still obey that limit.






          share|improve this answer









          $endgroup$



          No, it can't increase your ability scores over 20.



          The normal ability score limit of 20 is reiterated in a few different places in the 5e rules. First, in Chapter 1 of the PHB/basic rules, under the "Class Features and Hit Dice" subheading below "Beyond 1st Level":




          When your character gains a level, his or her class often grants additional features, as detailed in the class description. Some of these features allow you to increase your ability scores, either increasing two scores by 1 each or increasing one score by 2. You can’t increase an ability score above 20. In addition, every character's proficiency bonus increases at certain levels.




          It reiterates that the normal limit for adventurers is 20 in Chapter 7, under the "Ability Scores and Modifiers" heading:




          Each of a creature's abilities has a score, a number that defines the magnitude of that ability. An ability score is not just a measure of innate capabilities, but also encompasses a creature's training and competence in activities related to that ability.



          A score of 10 or 11 is the normal human average, but adventurers and many monsters are a cut above average in most abilities. A score of 18 is the highest that a person usually reaches. Adventurers can have scores as high as 20, and monsters and divine beings can have scores as high as 30.




          As shown by the above quotes, the text in the Ability Score Improvement feature that mentions the limit is actually redundant; even if it weren't in that feature's description, the ASI feature would still not let adventurers exceed the ability score maximum of 20.



          Although Prestige Classes as described in that Unearthed Arcana document are not exactly normal classes, the UA describes them as following the multiclassing rules, with additional prerequisites. Nothing in the UA says their Living Rune feature lets them supersede the normal ability score maximum - so they must still obey that limit.







          share|improve this answer












          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer










          answered 4 hours ago









          V2BlastV2Blast

          21.3k361134




          21.3k361134












          • $begingroup$
            Oh XD I didn't know an answer came up im on mobile and was typing haha. Well good answer though you saw a point o didn't <3 keep up good work !!
            $endgroup$
            – Deceptecium
            4 hours ago


















          • $begingroup$
            Oh XD I didn't know an answer came up im on mobile and was typing haha. Well good answer though you saw a point o didn't <3 keep up good work !!
            $endgroup$
            – Deceptecium
            4 hours ago
















          $begingroup$
          Oh XD I didn't know an answer came up im on mobile and was typing haha. Well good answer though you saw a point o didn't <3 keep up good work !!
          $endgroup$
          – Deceptecium
          4 hours ago




          $begingroup$
          Oh XD I didn't know an answer came up im on mobile and was typing haha. Well good answer though you saw a point o didn't <3 keep up good work !!
          $endgroup$
          – Deceptecium
          4 hours ago













          2












          $begingroup$

          It wouldn't be unheard of for a class feature to increase a stat above 20.



          Primal Champion page 49. PHB Barbarian level 20 feature.

          Your strength and Constitution scores increase by 4. Your maximum for those scores is now 24.



          However this is a level 20 feature and it specifically states that it increases the maximum of the score.



          Page 173 of the PHB, under the Ability Scores and Modifiers section says: "A score of 18 is the highest a person usually reaches. Adventurers can have scores as high as 20, and monsters and divine beings can have scores as high as 30.



          Considering specific beats general, since the Rune Scribe UA prestige class doesn't specifically say that it increases the ability score max, then it doesn't.






          share|improve this answer










          New contributor




          Deceptecium is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.






          $endgroup$













          • $begingroup$
            Your last line is in error: Specific beats general means that Rune Scribe doesn't need to explicitly state anything to create an exception to a general rule. That's how scoping works: since Rune Scribe is contained within the rules for creating player characters, any/all of its rules supercede the higher scope rules for creating characters whenever there is conflict.
            $endgroup$
            – the dark wanderer
            20 mins ago
















          2












          $begingroup$

          It wouldn't be unheard of for a class feature to increase a stat above 20.



          Primal Champion page 49. PHB Barbarian level 20 feature.

          Your strength and Constitution scores increase by 4. Your maximum for those scores is now 24.



          However this is a level 20 feature and it specifically states that it increases the maximum of the score.



          Page 173 of the PHB, under the Ability Scores and Modifiers section says: "A score of 18 is the highest a person usually reaches. Adventurers can have scores as high as 20, and monsters and divine beings can have scores as high as 30.



          Considering specific beats general, since the Rune Scribe UA prestige class doesn't specifically say that it increases the ability score max, then it doesn't.






          share|improve this answer










          New contributor




          Deceptecium is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.






          $endgroup$













          • $begingroup$
            Your last line is in error: Specific beats general means that Rune Scribe doesn't need to explicitly state anything to create an exception to a general rule. That's how scoping works: since Rune Scribe is contained within the rules for creating player characters, any/all of its rules supercede the higher scope rules for creating characters whenever there is conflict.
            $endgroup$
            – the dark wanderer
            20 mins ago














          2












          2








          2





          $begingroup$

          It wouldn't be unheard of for a class feature to increase a stat above 20.



          Primal Champion page 49. PHB Barbarian level 20 feature.

          Your strength and Constitution scores increase by 4. Your maximum for those scores is now 24.



          However this is a level 20 feature and it specifically states that it increases the maximum of the score.



          Page 173 of the PHB, under the Ability Scores and Modifiers section says: "A score of 18 is the highest a person usually reaches. Adventurers can have scores as high as 20, and monsters and divine beings can have scores as high as 30.



          Considering specific beats general, since the Rune Scribe UA prestige class doesn't specifically say that it increases the ability score max, then it doesn't.






          share|improve this answer










          New contributor




          Deceptecium is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.






          $endgroup$



          It wouldn't be unheard of for a class feature to increase a stat above 20.



          Primal Champion page 49. PHB Barbarian level 20 feature.

          Your strength and Constitution scores increase by 4. Your maximum for those scores is now 24.



          However this is a level 20 feature and it specifically states that it increases the maximum of the score.



          Page 173 of the PHB, under the Ability Scores and Modifiers section says: "A score of 18 is the highest a person usually reaches. Adventurers can have scores as high as 20, and monsters and divine beings can have scores as high as 30.



          Considering specific beats general, since the Rune Scribe UA prestige class doesn't specifically say that it increases the ability score max, then it doesn't.







          share|improve this answer










          New contributor




          Deceptecium is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.









          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer








          edited 3 hours ago









          V2Blast

          21.3k361134




          21.3k361134






          New contributor




          Deceptecium is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.









          answered 4 hours ago









          DecepteciumDeceptecium

          682111




          682111




          New contributor




          Deceptecium is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.





          New contributor





          Deceptecium is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.






          Deceptecium is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
          Check out our Code of Conduct.












          • $begingroup$
            Your last line is in error: Specific beats general means that Rune Scribe doesn't need to explicitly state anything to create an exception to a general rule. That's how scoping works: since Rune Scribe is contained within the rules for creating player characters, any/all of its rules supercede the higher scope rules for creating characters whenever there is conflict.
            $endgroup$
            – the dark wanderer
            20 mins ago


















          • $begingroup$
            Your last line is in error: Specific beats general means that Rune Scribe doesn't need to explicitly state anything to create an exception to a general rule. That's how scoping works: since Rune Scribe is contained within the rules for creating player characters, any/all of its rules supercede the higher scope rules for creating characters whenever there is conflict.
            $endgroup$
            – the dark wanderer
            20 mins ago
















          $begingroup$
          Your last line is in error: Specific beats general means that Rune Scribe doesn't need to explicitly state anything to create an exception to a general rule. That's how scoping works: since Rune Scribe is contained within the rules for creating player characters, any/all of its rules supercede the higher scope rules for creating characters whenever there is conflict.
          $endgroup$
          – the dark wanderer
          20 mins ago




          $begingroup$
          Your last line is in error: Specific beats general means that Rune Scribe doesn't need to explicitly state anything to create an exception to a general rule. That's how scoping works: since Rune Scribe is contained within the rules for creating player characters, any/all of its rules supercede the higher scope rules for creating characters whenever there is conflict.
          $endgroup$
          – the dark wanderer
          20 mins ago


















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